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Some might indeed. Sometimes I believe in God. Sometimes I want to believe in God. Sometimes I want to want to believe in God.
Some might indeed. Sometimes I believe in God. Sometimes I want to believe in God. Sometimes I want to want to believe in God.
Yes, YOU could argue that :)Originally Posted by Bricktop
And that's all it will ever be, an argument: I can't prove my case, and you can't disprove it. So I suppose we'll have to wait till death to see who's right.
Bless you friend.
T2.
ahh you got me! yes it was me that would argue that. busted.
right back at you brother.
Just an aside on the masculine/feminine thing.....
I used to play in a church music group, did so for 30 odd years or so, and about 10 years ago, we started seeing the masculine in the Mass, as in reference to God, replaced with a gender neutral terms. Also, some of the songs we played had the masculine taken out, and new songs were never gender specific. There was a move to see God in the context of both Father and Mother, and the Proper of the Mass and the music, reflected that trend.
Cheers
At this point in time I have faith in God. But as to what that faith looks like and how its played out... it seems to be going thru a reconstruction of sorts.
It seems as I get older I'm less and less convinced of anything.
The big problem with christianity, as I see it, is it happened more than two thousand years ago. There are always going to be major problems with historicity. Trying to apply an ancient text, to our lives today has its challenges.
Ultimately, noone can know what happens after we die, thats just the way it is. I wonder then, why I spend so much time thinking about it lol.
Maybe I should have entered this discussion earlier, but it seemed daunting. I've got quite a strong opinion, evolved from alot of pondering and reading. Even more so from every day human experience. Where does one start to try to put all this into words?
I'm a catholic by birth, raised in Ireland in Catholc schools. Segregated from other faiths for fear of our lives. At one point i used to go to mass 5 times a week. My parents thought (worried) that i might become a priest.
since then my faith has (in my opinion) matured somewhat.
Life, the universe, and all things spiritual is much more than Jesus and the New Testament. Maybe i'm wrong, but for me these days, all that "recent" stuff is of no consequence.
I consider myself much more than a "Christian". Christians are all about Christ by definition. I'm much more about God and the world around me. Christ is not my focal point. Thats a bit too basic, a bit too simplistic for me. A human story for humans to understand.
When i think of my God, i dont think of a handsom bearded guy, i see and feel him in the trees, in the breeze against my face, in the silence of the night, in the birds chirping in the morning waking me up.
I love being woken by the birds, birds are nature and nature is God.
I respect that some of you may laugh at this but my life up to now has been one big reinforcement of my faith.
Do i believe in "hell"? No, I dont. Some of my Born again Christian friends would start quoting chapter and verse of the old testament and call me a sinner who needs to spend his life repenting...... Get stuffed I say, you keep your God and i'll keep mine.
I understand totally where you are coming from and IMO i agree somewhat. What is your opinion when we die?
Hey thanks Rusha, yeah I misunderstood PD. I took it that he was putting down Christians when he completely wasnt - my bad. I shouldnt scan these threads i should sit down and read these properly - bit hard when at work and net at home is crap!
I understand totally Chris. I don't have net at home just yet so have to speed read/post on forums at work.
Dava I don't see anything to laugh at in your post. I actually think it goes along with what other people here have said/believe.
Dava, that's pretty much my experience now. I am very little about Jesus and very much about God. The reason I go to a Christian Church is that it provides me a fellow group of travellors who are on the same quest of discovery. Luckily, I go to a Church where no belief is criticised, every experience is valid, and God is not defined by traditional doctrine, Jesus or the Bible, although we might reference these things to acknowlege historical understandings or experiences.
Sounds like a Christian Spiritualist church.
I could have put this into the other thread on atheist ramblings, but thought it might be better suited here.
It would seem that humans are obsessed with living forever. Death is shocking, fearful and final. This has led to religions, spanning time and place, to being able to gain your trust and admiration by explaining its not all over for you once you heart beats its last bump, that in-fact (if you have been good enough) you will live forever in a paradise, with all the friends you can handle. I have to say that sounds great! except i better be able to choose who those people are.......
ummm, but how about this:
You can live forever, and its all related to how well you use your time breathing. We must at some point become reconciled with the fact we will only live once- except though our children or those we influence. You can live forever in hearts and minds. Its mathematical certainty that the more good work you do the longer you will be remembered. From raising good kids (might get you remembered a few generations) to starting a philosophical movement or a shining political career (should get you remembered forever)
if inclined you could also start a religion, but i could never condone that as something strictly "good". Though it seems to get you revered for centuries.
Of course doing something bad could also get you remembered for a long while as well, but thats up to you.
So stop doing good things just because you want into those pearly gates and start doing them because you have moral obligations to your fellow humans, and that is the only way to truly live forever.
and so ends today sermon.
Yes, good point.
I don't do good because I want to get into heaven - most people do good probably because they're fearful of going to hell - negative motivation. I think we should be good people because it is morally the right thing to do.
Actually, I think most people (even those who follow a religion) do good, because good is the thing to do.
The Kingdom of God is here on earth, not in heaven.
Cheers
Just in case anyone is wondering "why" we are drawn to doing good deeds (especially without the pressure of religion) its fact that altruistic behavior can be completely explained though evolutionary theory.
Your genetically programed to want to do nice things for people. So do it!
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